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Agent

Focus death and focus power from back for stabs

21 posts in this topic

Focus death should give 45% back damage for stabs acording the new fd descriptions from this season.Same thing for fp but bonus should be 30% back.But aint the case bonus from back is lower than this.There are more things to fix about daggers but i think we need take them 1 step at a time,thats why i will report just this for now.

Here an example:

Damage without fd on some other dagger using lethal blow--->https://imgur.com/a/lxgz8

Damage ~1350

Damage with fd from back using same skill ,in same duel,nothing changed except fd added

Damage~1600 --->https://imgur.com/a/Iwal8

So here is the theory if i as dagger(pw)i hit 1350 damage than by using fd from back i should stab with same skill 1350+45%=1950 so ~2k damage.

So there is a difference wich implies fd aint working correct.1600 damage is less than 2k.And same thing with focus power bonus from back for stabs

 

 

 

 

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idk u changed opinion since u the one who suggested the nerf on daggers and fought hard for it. anyways, at least now u realize the math makes no sense

lets not forget the 1st week of this season where there was not only this damage thingy, but also the 812938190221 delay to use melee skills. imo even more bugged than before

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Quote

1350+45%=1950

If things were such black and white l2j should never had a single issue with formulas, but its not.

How can you be so sure that the 45% is added last? after all other calculations are done?

Its exactly the opposite, first crit multipliers are calculated, and only then the rest of the formula, which might make this difference.

You should try it completely buffless if you want to be more accurate - aswell as if you're already posting it here for me to check I would need to know at least target's p.def.

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10 minutes ago, Lesley said:

idk u changed opinion since u the one who suggested the nerf on daggers and fought hard for it. anyways, at least now u realize the math makes no sense

lets not forget the 1st week of this season where there was not only this damage thingy, but also the 812938190221 delay to use melee skills. imo even more bugged than before

Come on dude,dont mess apples with oranges.All i want from daggers is to be close as retail daggers.Never wanted nerf ,never wanted boost,this are just speculative assumptions.

And 1 more thing,daggers that cried that daggers are weak were lame and cryers.Daggers are really strong class even without correct back bonus ....but there is a "but" and that aint feel as true dagger to me.If i feel something is wrong about a class i will always tell opinion about it in the right way how i consider and try be not biased if possible.And same things with bugs,if i find any i try not use them to my favor,but report them(another example was frenzy titan wich was fixed because of me).

Edited by Agent
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19 minutes ago, Emerald said:

If things were such black and white l2j should never had a single issue with formulas, but its not.

How can you be so sure that the 45% is added last? after all other calculations are done?

Its exactly the opposite, first crit multipliers are calculated, and only then the rest of the formula, which might make this difference.

You should try it completely buffless if you want to be more accurate - aswell as if you're already posting it here for me to check I would need to know at least target's p.def.

Emerald how its right now its not correct.Its not about l2j,its how retail dagger should be.And yes damage should be calculated as i said.Thats why i eliminated any critical power additives such vicoius stance,critical damage sa and passive(pw aint have such passive).Shouldnt be factors to makes it more complicated and is pretty much straight forward.FD is not additive its multiplicative.

Edited by Agent

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As you said in another publication ... "YOU CAN NOT TEST IN A DUEL" ... now use that against you ... try your luck with the training npc
 

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1 minute ago, metallica said:

As you said in another publication ... "YOU CAN NOT TEST IN A DUEL" ... now use that against you ... try your luck with the training npc
 

NO,you try your improve your brain,so u feel helpfull and relevant to such threads.

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15 hours ago, Agent said:

Emerald how its right now its not correct.Its not about l2j,its how retail dagger should be.And yes damage should be calculated as i said.Thats why i eliminated any critical power additives such vicoius stance,critical damage sa and passive(pw aint have such passive).Shouldnt be factors to makes it more complicated.FD is not additive its multiplicative.

That has nothing to do with what I said, I talked about the order of calculations in the formula, you think that the 45% is added last (so you think that from x you can directly calculate y) while the formula calculates crit muls first - before random damage, pvp bonus, crit bonus, target's p.def. and others - so you cannot really come and say how y should look like without knowing what you have along the way, since its not last in the calculation.

There is however a small error in the calculation which will be fixed next update (see below) but that will still not give you any significant boost.

Skill Power: 11546 (5773 base * 2 SS)
Dance of Fire: 1.35
Death Whisper: 1.35
Chant of Victory: 1.2
Focus Death: 1.9 (1.45 for skills)
PvP Bonus: 1.05
Target P.Def.: 1600

Damage (Without FD) = (11546 * 1.35 * 1.35 * 1.2) * (70 / 1600) * 1.05 = 25251.102 * 0.04375 * 1.05 = 1159

Before Fix:
Damage (With FD) = (11546 * 1.35 * 1.35 * 1.2 + (11546 * 1.9) / 2) * (70 / 1600) * 1.05 = (25251.102 + 10968.7) * 0.04375 * 1.05 = 36219.802 * 0.04375 * 1.05 = 1663

After Fix:
Damage (With FD) = (11546 * 1.35 * 1.35 * 1.2 * 1.45) * (70 / 1600) * 1.05 = 36614.0979 * (70 / 1600) * 1.05 = 1681

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39 minutes ago, Emerald said:

That has nothing to do with what I said, I talked about the order of calculations in the formula, you think that the 45% is added last (so you think that from x you can directly calculate y) while the formula calculates crit muls first - before random damage, pvp bonus, crit bonus, target's p.def. and others - so you cannot really come and say how y should look like without knowing what you have along the way, since its not last in the calculation.

There is however a small error in the calculation which will be fixed next update (see below) but that will still not give you any significant boost.

Skill Power: 11546 (5773 base * 2 SS)
Dance of Fire: 1.35
Death Whisper: 1.35
Chant of Victory: 1.2
Focus Death: 1.9 (1.45 for skills)
PvP Bonus: 1.05
Target P.Def.: 1600

Damage (Without FD) = (11546 * 1.35 * 1.35 * 1.2) * (70 / 1600) * 1.05 = 25251.102 * 0.04375 * 1.05 = 1159

Before Fix:
Damage (With FD) = (11546 * 1.35 * 1.35 * 1.2 + (11546 * 1.9) / 2) * (70 / 1600) * 1.05 = (25251.102 + 10968.7) * 0.04375 * 1.05 = 36219.802 * 0.04375 * 1.05 = 1663

After Fix:
Damage (With FD) = (11546 * 1.35 * 1.35 * 1.2 * 1.45) * (70 / 1600) * 1.05 = 36614.0979 * (70 / 1600) * 1.05 = 1681

Yeah i understand Emerald what u wanted to mean.But i spoke with others before and from my and their experience this bonus should apply at least 40-45% for fd and 25-30% for fp.Btw if u still can test this on rpg or u have someone to be sure,and not trust my words but i think im correct here.

And from what i rememember in past seasons fd was flat 90% bonus for stabs.Thats why aw/pw could land astronomical hits with lethal blow from back.

 

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I simply don't trust words, no matter who is behind them, without proofs.

I don't see a reason why FD would be treated differently from the other critical mul buffs.

And previous season it was the same formula as above, just with 1.9 instead of 1.45

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1 hour ago, Emerald said:

 

 

1 hour ago, Emerald said:

 

 

Before Fix:
Damage (With FD) = (11546 * 1.35 * 1.35 * 1.2 + (11546 * 1.9) / 2) * (70 / 1600) * 1.05 = (25251.102 + 10968.7) * 0.04375 * 1.05 = 36219.802 * 0.04375 * 1.05 = 1663

After Fix:
Damage (With FD) = (11546 * 1.35 * 1.35 * 1.2 * 1.45) * (70 / 1600) * 1.05 = 36614.0979 * (70 / 1600) * 1.05 = 1681

Watching this 2 strings i can tell that 1st context in wich fd was used is additive.But fd is multiplicative just like death whisper for example.

And 2nd string should be the correct one because is multiplicative context.

And also an observation i want to make,if u hit 1k without fd by using fd from back in your context is 1600 wich is even higher bonus?Isnt this wrong?It should be ~1400-1500 range because fd is 45%.

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9 minutes ago, Agent said:

if u hit 1k without fd by using fd from back in your context is 1600 wich is even higher bonus?Isnt this wrong?It should be ~1400-1500 range because fd is 45%.

 

1 hour ago, Emerald said:

you think that the 45% is added last (so you think that from x you can directly calculate y) while the formula calculates crit muls first

Again, you cannot calculate y from x just by adding 45%, see the above formula, its pdef that affects the final result.

Bonus will be smaller with higher pdef while bigger with lower pdef.

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Ah it was 1159 not quite 1k so my bad here.This coincide with the bonus wich should be meaning 45%.From your numbers right there it should be ok,i see no problem now.Dunno how will be in game after i test it :).

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The ratio damage between using fd and not using acording to your formula and taking your numbers should be

(11546 * 1.35 * 1.35 * 1.2 * 1.45) * (70 / 1600) * 1.05  / (11546 * 1.35 * 1.35 * 1.2 ) * (70 / 1600)* 1.05 =

=(11546*1.35*1.35*1.2)*(70/1600)* 1.05/(11546*1.35*1.35*1.2)*(70/1600)* 1.05 *1.45=1 *1.45

This result 1.45 is the exact bonus from fd(45%) and p def of target shouldnt influence it could be any number and wont affect this ratio.Correct me if im wrong Emerald.

 

Edited by Agent

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Agent in all the topics where I see your comments, I realize that you are looking for your own benefit and not for the good of the server, if you realize the daggers is the nerfiest class on the server and you complain that it is indestructible?

I do not understand you

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3 hours ago, MistIXIArtic said:

Agent in all the topics where I see your comments, I realize that you are looking for your own benefit and not for the good of the server, if you realize the daggers is the nerfiest class on the server and you complain that it is indestructible?

I do not understand you

Read again whats this topic about.Anything else what u say is just your wild imagination.The purpose of this topic was if focus death/focus power works properly and imo its not.And if its not working properly it needs a fix.Its dagger right to have a working,correct functionally focus power/focus death.

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On 22/12/2017 at 2:42 PM, Agent said:

NO,you try your improve your brain,so u feel helpfull and relevant to such threads.

better try to make a reasonable test, instead of crying for everything
and sry, I do not need to insult when I do not have arguments :))))

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5 hours ago, metallica said:

better try to make a reasonable test, instead of crying for everything
and sry, I do not need to insult when I do not have arguments :))))

Your reply are either unecessary or expired.And your contribution to this thread was zero.FD/FP seem to work better and closer than ever to a retail fd/fp.

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On 10/1/2018 at 1:39 PM, Agent said:

Your reply are either unecessary or expired.And your contribution to this thread was zero.FD/FP seem to work better and closer than ever to a retail fd/fp.

I only answered what you wrote in another post, therefore they are your own words.

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Dagger are all right after last tweak regarding fd/fp daggers,tested by me.But there is 1 thing left so that i can say that dagger to be fully fixed.Soulshot bonus for all 3 main stabs needs an adjustment,lethal blow tonned down because it gets too much soulshot bonus and deadly aint get any soulshot bonus.In the end damage for all 3 main stabs should be in same range with abit more for backstab such 20%.DPS wise as sum for the 3 main stabs should  remain same but with spike damage reduced from lethal and an increase in damage for deadly.

Edited by Agent

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