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Marovich

Expert skills on summoners

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Hi, does expert skills affect summoners pets? Like Pdef/mdef atk/matk atk speed/cspeed? Really need to know because now i need to decide which skills to take on experts. Also, what about additional buff slots for pets as well when learned buff books? Now i cant fit enough buffs even if i do not take any resists. Thanks in advance.

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UPDATE* I also noticed, that my Merrow unicorn with 4,8k patk deals more damage than magnus unicorn with 6,7k patk. i consider it as a bug.

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6 minutes ago, Zeff said:

 

Thats cool, its considered normal to have 2k more patk and deal less damage xD even though, its pvp server, and gm should consider to remake this. Also 19 buff slots for summon is low too.

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Was already reported about the damage, you can read this post.

About Expert Skills : only the one dedicated for servitors works, all others are for your character.

About more buffs for servitors : won't be changed.

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i saw that post, and still cant understand, why its like that? Even with this 19 buff limit i cant get proper buffs of my pet, i have to choose to be full fighter or full mage, but if i choose to take full mage buffs on my horse, it still hits for 300-400 with tidal wave, 79 magnus unicorn which aoe skill should hit for 1,5k-2k. This pvp penalty is just some miss understanding and lack of motivation to fix things.

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I have to agree with you, but I dunno well summoner class on this server. Need the input from other players.

It's true that NCSoft did not make some stats without a reason/purpose, but we did change some of thoses, such as for Titans and for Archers.
Since any servitor is quite easy to kill, that I can tell you, we could try to remove that 30% PvP damage reduction, or reduce it, outside of olympiad of course.

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Well, that would be great. Are you a GM or something?  I tested my Magnus unicorn skills damage with different buffs. What i got was, that with full mage buffs (empower,mystic dance, chant of magnus) i did 250 damage to other guy. Also with 6,7k patk on magnus and using his other meele skill which stuns the enemy, i hit for 550-600, and with 4,4k patk i did 480-510 damage. Also stun lands very rarely, most of the times 1 of 6 or 1 of 7 stuns the enemy without stun resist buffs or any rb jewels. Also extra 2-3 buff slots would be amazing, because as i said have to choose, either i do patk buffs, or matk buffs.

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8 hours ago, Marovich said:

Well, that would be great. Are you a GM or something?  I tested my Magnus unicorn skills damage with different buffs. What i got was, that with full mage buffs (empower,mystic dance, chant of magnus) i did 250 damage to other guy. Also with 6,7k patk on magnus and using his other meele skill which stuns the enemy, i hit for 550-600, and with 4,4k patk i did 480-510 damage. Also stun lands very rarely, most of the times 1 of 6 or 1 of 7 stuns the enemy without stun resist buffs or any rb jewels. Also extra 2-3 buff slots would be amazing, because as i said have to choose, either i do patk buffs, or matk buffs.

I hit daggers with full resists and normal m def (s jewels +6 at max) for 200 dmg with 8,2k m atk. Surrender +30 fail like everytime (1/7). While they can frontal me for 5k to the 1,6k p def. So, be glad for that summon dmg.

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4 hours ago, Eleanora said:

I hit daggers with full resists and normal m def (s jewels +6 at max) for 200 dmg with 8,2k m atk. Surrender +30 fail like everytime (1/7). While they can frontal me for 5k to the 1,6k p def. 

you forgot to say that you can spam it and use it like 10 times in 10 sec or even less, then this 200 dmg goes up to 600~700, with 2k mc or so.

if it's a dagger you will most likely cc him aswell and if one of the following; aqua dance or mbarrier or warding song (not so hard to take off one of these) the dmg goes to 1k~ with 4k~ mc. ( my own experience with you, 2,2k mdef)

also, this 5k front dmg is BS. I take max 4,5k~ with lethal CRIT from behind as mage with cov (1600~ pdef).
 

4 hours ago, Eleanora said:

So, be glad for that summon dmg.

their dmg is sh1t. Its ok dmg on season's begining but after ppl start to gear up...

Edited by fbs

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1 hour ago, fbs said:

you forgot to say that you can spam it and use it like 10 times in 10 sec or even less, then this 200 dmg goes up to 600~700, with 2k mc or so.

if it's a dagger you will most likely cc him aswell and if one of the following; aqua dance or mbarrier or warding song (not so hard to take off one of these) the dmg goes to 1k~ with 4k~ mc. ( my own experience with you, 2,2k mdef)

also, this 5k front dmg is BS. I take max 4,5k~ with lethal CRIT from behind as mage with cov (1600~ pdef).
 

their dmg is sh1t. Its ok dmg on season's begining but after ppl start to gear up...

Ask one of dagger in your clan to stab you to the face and then stab to the back. You will see there is 100 dmg difference. Checked with all kind of daggers.

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10 minutes ago, Eleanora said:

Ask one of dagger in your clan to stab you to the face and then stab to the back. You will see there is 100 dmg difference. Checked with all kind of daggers.

I know how much it differs, its not 100 dmg. I can test on you if you want to.

edit: i have both gh and th

Edited by fbs

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1 hour ago, fbs said:

I know how much it differs, its not 100 dmg. I can test on you if you want to.

edit: i have both gh and th

No one knows better than me how daggers work here and i can tell it 100% its wrong.Soulshot bonus for the main dagger skills aint working correct.Deadly doesnt even take any bonus at all while lethal takes higher bonus than backstab.Thats the explanation why lethal is the hardest hitter.About how should be is that backstab should get a higher bonus than lethal/deadly(aprox ~ 20% more).While deadly lethal should have arround same bonus.This dagger mechanics can be easily checked in youtube old retail videos with interlude.

Focus death and focus power also aint working correct.Its very easy to check,easiest and the most correct way is to check with a pw because u can avoid critical damage passive that th/aw got and also by not using a critical damage SA dagger weapon.Its the most reliable test to check the exact ammount of critical power bonus on stabs.From my tests made on dummy focus death gives arround ~10-15% damage and not 45% as it should.Its same thing for focus power.And yes this small damage is no more than ~100-200,so bassically difference in damage for daggers from front and back is negligible.Dagger kinda has same damage from all directions,with very smal damage difference(not the correct one).

Im pretty sure Emerald is aware of all of this,and prolly he will fix daggers at one point.Also is not easy task to fix them as exactly retail values.Im not even sure myself whats the exact and correct ammount of how much soulshot bonus should take from soulshots.Should be x2 by default for deadly/lethal like for others skills and ~x2.2/2.4 for backstab.Im not sure if thats the case and real value.

Edited by Agent

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10 minutes ago, Agent said:

And yes this small damage is no more than ~100-200

while you gain that from back, you lose the very same amount (or close to it) on front, so the actually difference is 400~ up to 800~ with lethal crit. 

I couldnt agree more with the rest you said, but i wasnt talking if daggers were/were not working as it should. 

 

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couldnt edit

i wouldnt rely on dummy test because i notice that there's no difference indeed on front dmg with npc's

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11 minutes ago, fbs said:

while you gain that from back, you lose the very same amount (or close to it) on front, so the actually difference is 400~ up to 800~ with lethal crit. 

I couldnt agree more with the rest you said, but i wasnt talking if daggers were/were not working as it should. 

 

Well it depends on target p def.When i did hit other dagger frontally with lethal was 1600 while from back with fd was 1800.Percentage wise i am correct its arround ~10/15 %.Ofc the lesser pdef target has the difference will increase but still will be negligible and never will be more than this 10-15% instead of 45%(how should be in case for focus death real bonus for stabs from behind),also i didnt account skill crits.

Edited by Agent

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Actually i messed abit the numbers.And i have tested in duel too not just on dummy, heres a small sample of what im talking about.And i used pw,as haste so critical power passive cannot alter test at all.

vs other dagger draco+6

lethal blow without focus death--->~1350

https://imgur.com/a/lxgz8

lethal blow with focus death hiting from behind--->~1600

https://imgur.com/a/Iwal8

Pictures speak for itself,bonus is what i said.in this case was arround ~18%.Still far from real value of fd that should give wich is 45% for stabs.

But as i said fd/fp correct bonuses arent the only issue with dagger.It starts with deadly,lethal and backstab and soulshot bonus wich is totaly wrong for them.Deadly has no bonus at all,while lethal gets highest,this are anomalies that indicates this skills needs check and fix too.

 

Edited by Agent

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i see, then i was mistaken about front dmg

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Well, i see there are a lot of problems with less popular classes, even tho i cant say that dagger isnt popular. I hope emerald will look into this and check summoners also daggerists damage.

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No i'm not a GM lol, hopefully for all of you. Can't play because of work so I get my frustration on the forum... while working ^^.

Off-Topic :

That soulshot bonus... Thought was fixed on every server like 10 years ago.
22. The Lethal Strike and skill critical effects (skill damage x2) have been added to Backstab, and the damage of Soulshots has been increased due to a change in the damage formula.
Source : http://legacy.lineage2.com/news/chronicle5_04.html

@Emerald In my opinion, you don't need to know the exact number to try, at least, to match the source we have.
Backstab gets more bonus from soulshots, let's have it. Nobody can complain. That applies to a lot of bugs.

About the servitors... 

We need to see more input from summoner players if some are around. And from Emerald.

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9 hours ago, fbs said:

you forgot to say that you can spam it and use it like 10 times in 10 sec or even less, then this 200 dmg goes up to 600~700, with 2k mc or so.

if it's a dagger you will most likely cc him aswell and if one of the following; aqua dance or mbarrier or warding song (not so hard to take off one of these) the dmg goes to 1k~ with 4k~ mc. ( my own experience with you, 2,2k mdef)

also, this 5k front dmg is BS. I take max 4,5k~ with lethal CRIT from behind as mage with cov (1600~ pdef).
 

their dmg is sh1t. Its ok dmg on season's begining but after ppl start to gear up...

10 times in 10 seconds? no mate , it's 20 times in 10 seconds ))), if not more xD.

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Mages can hit 1k+ with proeminence/hydroblast/hurricane/death spike if their combo lands such as vortex+surrender/glow.Mages were never weak,i have ridicoulous high jewels +14 aq +10 valakas +9 rest and still take 3k m crits from those mage with +20/30 skills and am +14/16......about what we talk here.Not to mention when is zerg mage arround cancel can tear apart any melee lurking arround(its more evident in server start).Also people dont talk that necro bane lands 100% also slow from sh/sorc is high rate and spammable as well.Surrenders are spammable,geodata will always be against melees,like debuffs aint enough handicap :).

And yes no class can use skills as fast as mage can spam.This apparent low damage per nuke aint low cause of how fast they execute.1k normal nukes+++ per nuke and 3k m crits its no joke damage,its more close to opness actually.

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46 minutes ago, Agent said:

Mages can hit 1k+ with proeminence/hydroblast/hurricane/death spike if their combo lands such as vortex+surrender/glow.Mages were never weak,i have ridicoulous high jewels +14 aq +10 valakas +9 rest and still take 3k m crits from those mage with +20/30 skills and am +14/16......about what we talk here.Not to mention when is zerg mage arround cancel can tear apart any melee lurking arround(its more evident in server start).Also people dont talk that necro bane lands 100% also slow from sh/sorc is high rate and spammable as well.Surrenders are spammable,geodata will always be against melees,like debuffs aint enough handicap :).

And yes no class can use skills as fast as mage can spam.This apparent low damage per nuke aint low cause of how fast they execute.1k normal nukes+++ per nuke and 3k m crits its no joke damage,its more close to opness actually.

Bane is very far away from having the same cripple potential as cc. It wont matter to bane a target that has full dark resist while sps/sorc can jump from hiting 200-300 without any debuffs to 1k+ with surrender/vortex and lucky cc, necro will hit max 500-600 with gloom, vortex (pray to land) and curse of abyss (pray to land also long cd). Not to mention its range is 150~200 while  cc is 500? 600?

cc > bane

surrender > gloom

every other vortex > dark vortex

Necros are fine as they are now and if happen any nerf they will become useless

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39 minutes ago, fbs said:

Bane is very far away from having the same cripple potential as cc. It wont matter to bane a target that has full dark resist while sps/sorc can jump from hiting 200-300 without any debuffs to 1k+ with surrender/vortex and lucky cc, necro will hit max 500-600 with gloom, vortex (pray to land) and curse of abyss (pray to land also long cd). Not to mention its range is 150~200 while  cc is 500? 600?

cc > bane

surrender > gloom

every other vortex > dark vortex

Necros are fine as they are now and if happen any nerf they will become useless

Loosing ww and haste as fighter aint good.Its 1 of worst cc after cancel for melees.And gloom can amplify damage from other mages as well not just for necro.Who cares about curse of abyss,bane lands 100%,u are siting duck,if u play th u may escape offen from bad situations but not all melees are blessed to have mirage and dash.

Edited by Agent

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if you want to consider multiple ppl atking one target then how can they be OP? 2 daggers or 2 archers can evaporate any robe MUCH quicker without worrying if debuffs landed. When you, sosa, and those other +16 archers go full assist on big maps, there's no mage party that can compete (same applies on smaller maps with daggers party assisting)

30 minutes ago, Agent said:

.Its 1 of worst cc after cancel for melees

taking resists, mbarrier, hp buff, 78 buffs, champion/renewal/warding song is FAR worse than ww/haste. OFC  its the second worst, there are like 3 types? cc, then necro/summoner bane then healer bane. if you can remember more, please feel free to share because i cant think of any.

Edited by fbs

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