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Posted (edited)
On 3/1/2020 at 12:07 PM, Silence said:

So right now, can you answer me on what kind of season are you aiming for?Short and often ones or long lasting ones?

This is what we should be discussing imo.

It could be easy if emerald just took the decision and state it, so people stop complaining. 

Would it be bad to aim for short and often ones? Just say that's the project's objective, and people will stop qqing every single 2nd season week.

Edit: We should all know by now, going for long lasting seasons hasnt been working. And we have fun anyways

Edited by Sophie

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2 hours ago, Sophie said:

This is what we should be discussing imo.

It could be easy if emerald just took the decision and state it, so people stop complaining. 

Would it be bad to aim for short and often ones? Just say that's the project's objective, and people will stop qqing every single 2nd season week.

Edit: We should all know by now, going for long lasting seasons hasnt been working. And we have fun anyways

Not too long, not too short. 2 months would be ideal.

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I see nothing in this topic that would actually make the server anymore fun & lasting longer, most of these suggestions are repeating themselves over and over and i've already made my reply in this matter a couple of times - even if some suggestions are good, I already see myself reverting them soon enough because people don't bother reading server features and will just come up complaining.

Small example is you requesting that people will play around with B-grade longer, now lets imagine 1-2 weeks into the season where people did get A-S grade since yeah you cannot avoid it, what will happen to a newbie that now comes and have to play *longer* with B-grade?

In general all these requests to make server "a lot harder" saying it will increase server lifetime are simply false statements, even now there are roughly 50% players quitting before getting anywhere near endgame gear, this statistic gets even worse on higher game versions such as H5, there are only a handful of players going for endgame gear, rest quit long before it.

Another annoying comments I see here often is how this server last for 2 weeks, so NO, the server doesn't last for 2 weeks, its YOU who decide to quit after 2 weeks, you are complaining about a problem which you are a major part of, the server can last years if people would simply stick to it instead of quitting and waiting for new seasons all the time.

The even more annoying part are the excuses, all these seasons the main excuse was me making changes mid-season, now the excuse is me not making any changes, are you serious?

My last statements do not target the topic author, but these who made comments here and on other topics, they'll know who they are.

And the statements @Chevignon made are indeed correct, people mostly make suggestions based on servers that used to work back in ~2010, think that these changes would "catch" nowadays aswell, do you have ANY idea how many servers I saw attempting to copy infinitel2 or other famous servers and failed within a few days/weeks of opening? that never even made it back anymore.

 

Anyway bottom line (and speaking from experience obviously) all these small changes here and there won't be helping, i'm working on different game versions (classic & prelude of war) which should keep the community engaged with new stuff, this is going to take some time getting done thought.

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Last 4 interlude seasons (havent played h5, so idk)  lasted less than 1 month (I mean with decent population). 2 months is unachievable imo. Plus, I think 90% of players would agree that first 2 weeks are the most enjoyable ones.

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looking forward to the new chroncles, hopefully i dont have to play too many H5/IL till you can bring us a semi-polished season with one of those chronciles  🙂

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37 minutes ago, Emerald said:

I see nothing in this topic that would actually make the server anymore fun & lasting longer, most of these suggestions are repeating themselves over and over and i've already made my reply in this matter a couple of times - even if some suggestions are good, I already see myself reverting them soon enough because people don't bother reading server features and will just come up complaining.

How about you try to bring the Files from season`s which were more successfull, populated and lasted longer?  1-2 Interlude seasons before H5 werent like this, if you think that all the changes people suggesting are not helping at all, then just ignore them and run the version of server that had the highest peak and population. Step back to the past sometimes can be the solution, maybe you are indeed right that all those changes are the thing .You working on Classic/Prelude so giving it a try can have beneficial outcome, at least for now till new chronicle appears.

37 minutes ago, Emerald said:

In general all these requests to make server "a lot harder" saying it will increase server lifetime are simply false statements, even now there are roughly 50% players quitting before getting anywhere near endgame gear, this statistic gets even worse on higher game versions such as H5, there are only a handful of players going for endgame gear, rest quit long before it.

Community is always one of the biggest problems/server game changes. Its hard nowadays to bring a good and long lasting server IF its a lowrate one, your server can be exception for this because its not standard L2 Interlude lowrate that lots of people know, its PvP one,  road to gear and character improvement is way different than path on Java/Official one, you have big display field right here, based on your own experience. You can change progression/prices/way to upgrade Character. This is one of the problems why current L2 Lowrates private servers are like 1-4 week servers alive, people know what and when to do.

OvC is completely different in that thing and this is exactly why the experience for new players and old is better.

37 minutes ago, Emerald said:

My last statements do not target the topic author, but these who made comments here and on other topics, they'll know who they are.

And the statements @Chevignon made are indeed correct, people mostly make suggestions based on servers that used to work back in ~2010, think that these changes would "catch" nowadays aswell, do you have ANY idea how many servers I saw attempting to copy infinitel2 or other famous servers and failed within a few days/weeks of opening? that never even made it back anymore.

There are plenty of reasons why they are dying, side balance/lost GM`s that are going mostly for the money and dont fix anything/job and nostalgia itself to join Lineage for a while, lets say for weekend and go back to reality with smile on face.

Its not just OvC,  community on any kind of server is like this unless we speak about Russians that are still the old-school players which make the server and game real. They have everything in the right place, they are competitive/they dont emo quit if their side is losing/ they farming the end game fully and play even after it.

37 minutes ago, Emerald said:

Anyway bottom line (and speaking from experience obviously) all these small changes here and there won't be helping, i'm working on different game versions (classic & prelude of war) which should keep the community engaged with new stuff, this is going to take some time getting done thought.

Classic OvC *.*  I just hope it wont be 2.5 or higher that fcked up things.

Dream coming true!

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53 minutes ago, Emerald said:

Another annoying comments I see here often is how this server last for 2 weeks, so NO, the server doesn't last for 2 weeks, its YOU who decide to quit after 2 weeks, you are complaining about a problem which you are a major part of, the server can last years if people would simply stick to it instead of quitting and waiting for new seasons all the time.

With all the respect i don't agree with this statement. And i'm answering to this cause i said that the server lasted 2 weeks. I have 3 hero counts this season and i've managed to take hero since first week. The 3rd week of the server we barely had 5 people to do olys. The 4th week which started the previous Monday there were barely 10 people online whole week. I can understand that my answer maybe make feel angry or annoys you but unfortunately it's the truth. And of course i'm not blaming you about the situation.  Major factor was that the only organized clan in chaos faction(with 30++ members) decided to quit after 1 week cause they can't stand competition. 

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1 hour ago, TheStinger said:

With all the respect i don't agree with this statement. And i'm answering to this cause i said that the server lasted 2 weeks. I have 3 hero counts this season and i've managed to take hero since first week. The 3rd week of the server we barely had 5 people to do olys. The 4th week which started the previous Monday there were barely 10 people online whole week. I can understand that my answer maybe make feel angry or annoys you but unfortunately it's the truth. And of course i'm not blaming you about the situation.  Major factor was that the only organized clan in chaos faction(with 30++ members) decided to quit after 1 week cause they can't stand competition. 

That still doesn't contradict with what I said, the fact you leave after 2 weeks doesn't mean season ends in 2 weeks, season is still going.

If every person PMing me asking "when next season" would simply play the goddamn server it would still be in full population, people don't even care if there would be changes or not, all I get is people asking when next season all day long because people simply like starting from scratch together with everyone, funniest (or saddest actually) PMs are from people who missed 2 days or so from the opening and are already waiting the next season...

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53 minutes ago, Emerald said:

season is still going.

true, but without players

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Hi Emerald, thanks for replying, just send this to denied and keep on going, I will just say that all the coppies of Infinite closed because they got sued and RvB was the most successful one, it closed because there were problems at the start with their server and the game and the admin just closed it thats it. And still RvB had 600-700 people last time on start for a month and then died ... however i tried to help and obviously you can counter forever.... 

And telling me that im part of the problem is not cool really, I just tried to help with my best, and I quit because I felt like I got bored, and you cannot judge me for my decision, and for that reason i created this topic. Try to keep your anger and don't be stubborn as I see everybody who create a topic and just suggest something with their good feelings got smashed by your negative answers and thats it, like we are your enemies, thats how it looks like.

GL 

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4 hours ago, Emerald said:

That still doesn't contradict with what I said, the fact you leave after 2 weeks doesn't mean season ends in 2 weeks, season is still going.

If every person PMing me asking "when next season" would simply play the goddamn server it would still be in full population, people don't even care if there would be changes or not, all I get is people asking when next season all day long because people simply like starting from scratch together with everyone, funniest (or saddest actually) PMs are from people who missed 2 days or so from the opening and are already waiting the next season...

But i didn't leave 🙂 I've been playing here for 6 years and i believe that i'm the last person who quits the server. Literally. And it's painful.

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Posted (edited)

Just a thought Emerald.There were some seasons that lasted like 2-3 months .It was some time ago ,dunno exactly how many seasons ago or even what year .Maybe u can check the configuration of your server when it was the most populated .Because since than many things changed .For example melees didnt have such a hard time because of the new maps .This new domination maps and escorts in wich the pvp is concentrated in 1 point between spawns didnt exist as well .Its just silly for the melees they are spectators watching range pvp .Forts its kinda similar but there are walls ,people can go pvp inside and outside .But outdoor maps like escort and domination are terrible and unbalanced as hell .Anyway this is just some example,there should be others as well .

 

Maybe go back to that point and try a new direction to improve the server?Also try to improve geodata ,again its terrible .It can be fixed ,u just need better files  .Maybe ask for suport and L2ovc community will go donate ,dont think will be a problem .

Or maybe go for a l2 classic .That might be fun too dunno .But i think server in this configuration that is right now ,it wont get better .

Edited by Lebron
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If i had to guess i would say there were no adena scrolls or stream buff when seasons lasted more than 60 days.

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And your point about infinitel2 was wrong. When infinitel2 closed because Erb stopped focusing on lineage 2 and went to aion where the money was, builder and aba was left with the server and when Builder (who didn't know how to code) couldnt add new features and did the same thing over and over and over (server was still successful even with another year with the same shit) the server finally started decreasing in population until aba (seamonster) stole money from the server and thats when the server perma closed.

After it was closed, a guy named mcnugget reopened a copy of the server with the same source code etc and the server instantly had 200-300+ players and was insanely popular until "someone", i wonder who, sued the server and forced it to close. Since then, the only server even REMOTELY similar to infinitel2 has been russian idiots trying to copy it or an incomplete sourced file of it which obviously has sucked.

There's a reason why infinitel2 is still talked about 10 years later. That server found the close to perfect balance for a faction server and each season lasted months at a time.

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11 hours ago, Emerald said:

Another annoying comments I see here often is how this server last for 2 weeks, so NO, the server doesn't last for 2 weeks, its YOU who decide to quit after 2 weeks, you are complaining about a problem which you are a major part of, the server can last years if people would simply stick to it instead of quitting and waiting for new seasons all the time.

When they lose ppl quit, like @TheStingersaid this season the only big clan on chaos side pretty much died after 1 week, so after that many problem started on the server since the balance of side was really bad.

As i remember it was asked in the past (i think from @maze / @Lesley ) to have a "free" clan side change (clan/players) so 1 or more (depend there members amount) clan could change side to "repair" the balance.

@Emerald i know there is a way to pay for it(i dont remember the price but i dont think its expensive), so i know its possible to do it without your "help", but i think if an offer like this would come from you(like making forum post asking if a clan would be up to change side) it would "help" the server and have alot of impact for the current season. Thats just my opinion so dont take it bad 😛

 

Another idea we had and we decided to not post it with @Silence cause its asking some "kind" of basic server rework i would say is that your character doesnt have any faction anymore(you login and you just pick your class from npc), he is just "neutral", the faction pick would only be for/inside event(TP in town would have 2 button "join as order or chaos") and when the event is over the char go back to "neutral" side. I think that kind of system would prevent and a solve every single problem of "side" balance with too many big clan/organized party on 1 side, ofc except if they all decide to always pick the same side, but then i would be stupid move from them. It would also have no impact at all on the side balance if like this season 1 big clan quit since with the "neutral" system it wouldnt make order or chaos weaker/stronger.

Dunno what @Emeraldwould think about it, in the end the Order vs Chaos would still be +/- the same, 2 side fighting to win the event.

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Good morning, 

Like i posted in the forum i played some faction servers around and i think the best way is to make it simple, just think about the past of the server was better then present:

1. Jewels - Boss ( whats the use of raid boss event if you can buy them from the merchant shop ? ) make a decent rate for all raid bosses drop and players will enjoy raid boss. Start from level 60 in C grade Gear ( make C grade gear free ) players can earn xp/sp adena from pvp / farm zone.

Future the stronger enemy is ( depending on his level / gear ) the better you can earn adena.

2. Misc - Ancient Books and Red Primeval Crystal ( Ancient books you can receive anyway from Rank up and Red Primeval Crystal you have change from lucky chest ) 

3. Recipes - all ( You can get recipes from Recipe Chests )

4. Parts - all ( You can get parts from Parts Box Chest ) 

5. Materials - all ( You can get materials from Material Box Chest )  

7. Soul Crystals - all ( You have chance to get from Lucky Chest Box ) 

Remove the gift section ...

In this way also the market square will be more popular Buying/Selling.

 

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Posted (edited)

@Emerald
It's clear that the unsuccess of those last seasons which had lively periods for about 2-3 weeks should not be put solely on you, but it's clear that something ain't working and you obviously can see it by urself, right ?  
I know that no one can guarantee that his suggestions will lead to this or that and be the key to the success, but at least you can try. What's there to lose ? At worse it will be another 2-3 weeks lasting season.
I think that from those years that passed you should have some clarity about some of the players of the community that proposed certain things and have contributed to the server so you can consult based on their thoughts.
Some of us have played here back in the day(2016-2017) on seasons that lasted for 3+ months, one even was on for 97 days and had decent online count for about 75 days.
Personally i skipped the past 4-5 seasons since i knew what the outcome will be, and i don't want put in 4-5 hours of my free time in something that i know will fail after 2 weeks. We all know that for a player to be competitive in OVC he needs to play more regularly the first week or two so he can enjoy the highest online count and progress equally and not be left behind from the pack. Trying to catch the rest after couple of weeks by playing 1-2 hours per day is not pleasant and easy to do. I know that MMORPG are time-wise demanding and you can't expect to exactly on par with those who play more than you, but those early OVC seasons that I've played were suitable for guys like me and others who can't or don't wan't to play 10h+ per day so they can be competitive. It was enough to play more regularly in the first days and gain the basic things and later enjoy the game by playing in your spare time for couple of hours like a normal grown up person should do. 
I think you should go back to the old server setup and transfer some of the good features that you've implemented in the last seasons.
Current features like the present Rank system and Vote Reward are simply harming the server.

I will briefly write couple of things that should be changed and were present on back of those successful seasons that if you can combine with some of the good current ones will lead to a high probability of better lasting season:

  • A-grade has to be free after 2-3 weeks max so that newcomers can have better chances against higher geared ones. It's Interlude, for a person to be competitive with all classes all he needs is proper buff scheme and A-grade(daggers do fine in B-grade but that's another thing).
  • Rank/Expert system: the old expert system were you obtained all the expert books from just leveling 80 lvl on main and sub classes was the best setup balance-wise.
  • ELO System: it's clearly that something is not working, there is an 5k ELO cap now, but it's seems that it does not account properly and disturbs the balance count. Seems similar to back in the day were there wasn't ELO cap and me and Chaks had approximately around 120k ELO while most of top geared guys were on 20-30k and that led to online count on maps with 5 players versus 30 and similar situations.
    Balance and online count should be put solely on online numbers with contrast of approximately let's say 5 players per faction.
  • Vote Reward should be removed or changed to give only extra adena or something other that does not interfere balance-wise like those extra stats it gives now.
  • GOD Motivation buff should be removed.
  • PVP/Farm reward system should be mainly by doing PVP and not objectives. Objectives like Domination zone/Escort and etc. should give some extra adena/stuff and not be the main reward source. Combined with the Old expert system that way those who play Warlords/Tanks will be mostly ones who play those classes for PVP purposes and not just to farm adena faster and rank up for the expert books.

Those are some of the most important things that comes to my mind right now, if you are willing to act on the suggestions and you need help to introduce or alter them so they can be implemented correctly and successfully i'm sure with some of the guys that i wrote about above we can discuss the features more detailed!

Edited by Redman
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Posted (edited)
28 minutes ago, Redman said:

@Emerald
I think you should go back to the old server setup and transfer some of the good features that you've implemented in the last seaon.

I will briefly write couple of things that should be changed and were present on back of those successful seasons that if you can combine with some of the good current ones will lead to a high probability of better lasting season:

  • A-grade has to be free after 2-3 weeks max so that newcomers can have better chances against higher geared ones. It's Interlude, for a person to be competitive with all classes all he needs is proper buff scheme and A-grade(daggers do fine in B-grade but that's another thing).
  • Rank/Expert system: the old expert system were you obtained all the expert books from just leveling 80 lvl on main and sub classes was the best setup balance-wise.
  • ELO System: it's clearly that something is not working, there is an 5k ELO cap now, but it's seems that it does not account properly and disturbs the balance count. Seems similar to back in the day were there wasn't ELO cap and me and Chaks had approximately around 120k ELO while most of top geared guys were on 20-30k and that led to online count on maps with 5 players versus 30 and similar situations.
    Balance and online count should be put solely on online numbers with contrast of approximately let's say 5 players per faction.
  • Vote Reward should be removed or changed to give only extra adena or something other that does not interfere balance-wise like those extra stats it gives now.
  • GOD Motivation buff should be removed.
  • PVP/Farm reward system should be mainly by doing PVP and not objectives. Objectives like Domination zone/Escort and etc. should give some extra adena/stuff and not be the main reward source. Combined with the Old expert system that way those who play Warlords/Tanks will be mostly ones who play those classes for PVP purposes and not just to farm adena faster and rank up for the expert books. 

Totally agree with all things except Vote Reward since this feature works well for both newcomers/veterans I dont think it requires bigger rework, it provides only defensive stats.

A-Grade free stuff ended badly in the past BUT you should remember that its not just Playerbase fault from my point of view. There was no annoucement at all, it was just too sudden decision. If you would add some timer after people are logging in like: 

"A-grades will become free in x days" - Community reaction would be different, same for the market in base and all the people that joined later and farmed A graded 1-2 days before it happened.

+1 also to coming back to the past. Exactly, there has to be a reason as @Redman said that the 1-2 years ago seasons were so successfull and were lasting longer.

Edited by Silence
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57 minutes ago, xXxMissxXx said:

Pools are the best when you want to change something , i will recommend this in the near future

Like people voting for Trump/Boris ?
Emerald should know pretty well who to listen and who to ignore. There are plenty reasonable guys who played with older and newer server setups, guys with more than 3 years of experience playing in OVC, ones who give proper thoughtful suggestions.
Random polls won't solve anything!  

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8 hours ago, Scaretactic said:

until "someone", i wonder who, sued the server and forced it to close.

HOw is this even a thing lol? XD how can you sue a server dude... it's some next level bullshit for me...

I've seen a lot of BS... FBI closing servers for L2... but first time this lol...

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2 hours ago, Redman said:

I will briefly write couple of things that should be changed and were present on back of those successful seasons that if you can combine with some of the good current ones will lead to a high probability of better lasting season:

  • A-grade has to be free after 2-3 weeks max so that newcomers can have better chances against higher geared ones. It's Interlude, for a person to be competitive with all classes all he needs is proper buff scheme and A-grade(daggers do fine in B-grade but that's another thing).
  • Rank/Expert system: the old expert system were you obtained all the expert books from just leveling 80 lvl on main and sub classes was the best setup balance-wise.
  • ELO System: it's clearly that something is not working, there is an 5k ELO cap now, but it's seems that it does not account properly and disturbs the balance count. Seems similar to back in the day were there wasn't ELO cap and me and Chaks had approximately around 120k ELO while most of top geared guys were on 20-30k and that led to online count on maps with 5 players versus 30 and similar situations.
    Balance and online count should be put solely on online numbers with contrast of approximately let's say 5 players per faction.
  • Vote Reward should be removed or changed to give only extra adena or something other that does not interfere balance-wise like those extra stats it gives now.
  • GOD Motivation buff should be removed.
  • PVP/Farm reward system should be mainly by doing PVP and not objectives. Objectives like Domination zone/Escort and etc. should give some extra adena/stuff and not be the main reward source. Combined with the Old expert system that way those who play Warlords/Tanks will be mostly ones who play those classes for PVP purposes and not just to farm adena faster and rank up for the expert books.

Those are some of the most important things that comes to my mind right now, if you are willing to act on the suggestions and you need help to introduce or alter them so they can be implemented correctly and successfully i'm sure with some of the guys that i wrote about above we can discuss the features more detailed!

Old rank system with expert skill just from leveling was perfect. Ppl have to make new subs it forced diversity of classes on every map. It was easy to understand what is your goal  of progressione with your char. 

Now its look like this you  play for  14 days  for around 6-8h and you are not sure that you will miss score or something else to reach last rank. Other downside of current system it force ppl to play all time pvp class (score class like tank?)to by most efficient after some time ppl get bored. Old rank system was better from one simple reason you just have to play and you  dont have to look on your score to progress. It didnt force ppl to by competitive. You just have to enjoy pvp and lvl up.

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16 minutes ago, Venth said:

Vote Reward should be removed or changed to give only extra adena or something other that does not interfere balance-wise like those extra stats it gives now.

Just make it that player gets 1k adena and people will take it anyway lul

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4 hours ago, Redman said:

I will briefly write couple of things that should be changed and were present on back of those successful seasons that if you can combine with some of the good current ones will lead to a high probability of better lasting season:

  • A-grade has to be free after 2-3 weeks max so that newcomers can have better chances against higher geared ones. It's Interlude, for a person to be competitive with all classes all he needs is proper buff scheme and A-grade(daggers do fine in B-grade but that's another thing).
  • Rank/Expert system: the old expert system were you obtained all the expert books from just leveling 80 lvl on main and sub classes was the best setup balance-wise.
  • ELO System: it's clearly that something is not working, there is an 5k ELO cap now, but it's seems that it does not account properly and disturbs the balance count. Seems similar to back in the day were there wasn't ELO cap and me and Chaks had approximately around 120k ELO while most of top geared guys were on 20-30k and that led to online count on maps with 5 players versus 30 and similar situations.
    Balance and online count should be put solely on online numbers with contrast of approximately let's say 5 players per faction.
  • Vote Reward should be removed or changed to give only extra adena or something other that does not interfere balance-wise like those extra stats it gives now.
  • GOD Motivation buff should be removed.
  • PVP/Farm reward system should be mainly by doing PVP and not objectives. Objectives like Domination zone/Escort and etc. should give some extra adena/stuff and not be the main reward source. Combined with the Old expert system that way those who play Warlords/Tanks will be mostly ones who play those classes for PVP purposes and not just to farm adena faster and rank up for the expert books.

Those are some of the most important things that comes to my mind right now, if you are willing to act on the suggestions and you need help to introduce or alter them so they can be implemented correctly and successfully i'm sure with some of the guys that i wrote about above we can discuss the features more detailed!

  • A-Grade - This issue would be fixed if players would be forced to invest in A grades. After veterans would switch to S grade there would be an influx of sets on the market like it's happening now when people are switching from nukers to archers.
  • Rank/Expert system: true, the current rank system is not good for me either. my time is limited and I never got passed rank 7 because server usually dies before I get to 6 =)) Also I want my title back.
  • Vote reward: I find it harmless. maybe you were talking about Stream reward?
  • ELO System: There were so many times when I had to wait a lot because I couldn't join events on either side, or because I couldn't join same faction with my team.  Would be nice to implement that option of transferring entire party to the losing side.

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